Due to Substack's infernal wandering radial button problem, this post was sent to subscribers only. I have made it publicly available here. Don't worry, there's a good subscriber-only piece this week as well as the subscriber writing post and the conclusion of our book club.
Dragging a Dead Deer Up a Hill is my favorite marriage of Grouper’s mastery of mood and texture and her pop sensibilities, but Alien Observer is also flawless.
These are great! But personally I already like most of these niche genres. I put in a reader request for a Getting Started With on the two types of music I've tried to get into but never could: jazz and pre-romantic classical music.
'Jazz' seems to me to be too big for a 'getting started' post – tho maybe that means it should be a 'meta' post discussing that fact, and pointing out _some_ of the smaller component niches to be explored.
An obvious way to get started is to read/follow the history – and listen to the relevant music as you go.
I feel like 'modern jazz' is everywhere and nowhere at the same time. There _is_ modern 'jazz', and even some 'pure' (or 'purer') modern jazz, but a lot (most?) is some flavor of 'jazz fusion'. I like Medeski Martin & Wood and Marco Benevento but don't think of them as (modern) 'jazz jazz'.
A lot of the best music YouTubers are 'jazz trained' musicians, or even practicing/recording/touring 'jazz' musicians, and they _can_ play 'jazz jazz', even if they're _mostly_ ALSO drawing on their knowledge of basically every other genre too.
"pre-romantic classical music" is probably much easier. (I'm guessing you're referring to European "pre-romantic classical music".) There's something like a canon (or several/many). Listening/learning the history is one way to survey this too – really a way to start learning/listening to any genre/category of music (or anything else).
I remember trying to get into jazz as a teen and every best album ever list used to just tokenistically put Miles Davis - Kind Of Blue in there, which is a great record but has nothing to do with the rock music I was listening to back then.
Since then I've got more into lots of other black music.
But I still think 70s electric Miles is the way into jazz if you like say rock music or other things.
Great list Freddie. Two now defunct Texas drone bands/projects to add: American Analog Set and the 1999 album "The Golden Band." Droney mellow indie rock. Very pleasent and chill. Also, Stars of the Lid, any album really but "the tired sounds of stars of the Lid" and "and thier refinement of the decline" are both so beautiful. Drone ambient.
Have you tried Grouper’s side projects? I love Nivhek and Raul, and I hope to spend more time with Helen. All of them are less pop-structured than Grouper’s (excellent) current work, and may appeal to those who miss early Grouper.
Grouper’s one of my very favorite musicians of all time. I’ve seen her live twice, including recently at the Hollywood Forever crematorium, which was so good it was an out-of-body experience. I listen to Grouper every night to go to sleep.
Something about her music makes me feel like I’m levitating, like I’m in a world that’s softer and less constricted by gravity and pressure, like she’s letting some air out of an overstuffed, humid room. Her music is so delicate and gossamer-like that it feels like foam on seawater, constantly breaking apart and rejoining. I can’t express how much I love it, just that I do, so much. I listen to her to sleep and I listen to her to slow down because she demands my attention to sift through the lightness and fragility of her work to find those devastatingly lovely core melodies.
Thank you for this. I’m always looking for new ambient drone artists.
I love how detailed you were about your love for Grouper. My own love for her music comes very effortlessly, which is a rare thing for me.
I remember constantly listening to Dragging a Dead Deer...none of my friends were really into it so it felt like a very solitary experience, which heightened it all by making it so personal, private.
Thank you! This is one of those genres (on the lighter side--I top out at shoegaze or maybe late Deafheaven for my “heavy” meter), but never know where to start.
Though as a non-partaker of the doob maybe I’ll always be missing something.
As an occasional partaker of the doob, all it does for me is accentuate what I'm experiencing. If you can unmoor your mind and let it drift out, you've got 95% of it.
Freddie, are you listening to any of that OG Indian drone stuff? If not, you should. Don't worry about which artist to start with, it's not a genre with a lot of poorly crafted pieces. You can just pull up some hour long YouTube video with a buddha statue. It's a "sink in and vaguely visualize a tree growing from seed to full splendor" experience that really dampens the mind's pandemonium.
Gotta rep some OGs (there’ll be a few posts here, b/c phone). First up: the Pastels, who mostly did poppy things but dropped this monster on a 12” https://youtu.be/Eqdn8msxAbk
Not suggesting you've not heard these but some other stuff I like in this style:
Stars Of The Lid
My favourite Pauline Oliveros album is Deep Listening
Kallie Malone is an interesting newer artist.
A bit more electronic but I really recommend the Spanish artist Suso Saiz, his latest album Resonant Bodies is particularly great, tho he has a big body of work.
I lean towards more electronic music in this style so the list of ambient stuff is almost endless but those are some that I'd recommend!
No Labradford, no peace. Know Labradford, know peace.
Due to Substack's infernal wandering radial button problem, this post was sent to subscribers only. I have made it publicly available here. Don't worry, there's a good subscriber-only piece this week as well as the subscriber writing post and the conclusion of our book club.
Grouper is the shit. A I A: Alien Observer is my personal favorite but it's hard to pick a best.
Dragging a Dead Deer Up a Hill is my favorite marriage of Grouper’s mastery of mood and texture and her pop sensibilities, but Alien Observer is also flawless.
GROUPER
Grouper is too good!
No Godspeed You! Black Emperor? Off to reddit to complain for me…
Because music is not A Big Thing for me, I hadn't heard of most of these. This is a fascinating genre. Thanks for all the recs!
These are great! But personally I already like most of these niche genres. I put in a reader request for a Getting Started With on the two types of music I've tried to get into but never could: jazz and pre-romantic classical music.
'Jazz' seems to me to be too big for a 'getting started' post – tho maybe that means it should be a 'meta' post discussing that fact, and pointing out _some_ of the smaller component niches to be explored.
An obvious way to get started is to read/follow the history – and listen to the relevant music as you go.
I feel like 'modern jazz' is everywhere and nowhere at the same time. There _is_ modern 'jazz', and even some 'pure' (or 'purer') modern jazz, but a lot (most?) is some flavor of 'jazz fusion'. I like Medeski Martin & Wood and Marco Benevento but don't think of them as (modern) 'jazz jazz'.
A lot of the best music YouTubers are 'jazz trained' musicians, or even practicing/recording/touring 'jazz' musicians, and they _can_ play 'jazz jazz', even if they're _mostly_ ALSO drawing on their knowledge of basically every other genre too.
"pre-romantic classical music" is probably much easier. (I'm guessing you're referring to European "pre-romantic classical music".) There's something like a canon (or several/many). Listening/learning the history is one way to survey this too – really a way to start learning/listening to any genre/category of music (or anything else).
Yeah jazz is super diverse... much like metal this would be many pieces
I'd love to read a 'meta metal' post by Freddie too tho!
I remember trying to get into jazz as a teen and every best album ever list used to just tokenistically put Miles Davis - Kind Of Blue in there, which is a great record but has nothing to do with the rock music I was listening to back then.
Since then I've got more into lots of other black music.
But I still think 70s electric Miles is the way into jazz if you like say rock music or other things.
Get Up With It would be my recommendation.
The Dave Brubeck Quartet – and "Time Out" specifically – was my own entry into 'jazz jazz' coming from 'rock' (and (European) 'classical') music.
Great list Freddie. Two now defunct Texas drone bands/projects to add: American Analog Set and the 1999 album "The Golden Band." Droney mellow indie rock. Very pleasent and chill. Also, Stars of the Lid, any album really but "the tired sounds of stars of the Lid" and "and thier refinement of the decline" are both so beautiful. Drone ambient.
Seconding American Analog Set, haven't thought about them in a long time!
Second Stars of the Lid. Tim Hecker, too. Lots of good stuff on the Kranky label in general.
Maybe even Ben Frost.
Have you tried Grouper’s side projects? I love Nivhek and Raul, and I hope to spend more time with Helen. All of them are less pop-structured than Grouper’s (excellent) current work, and may appeal to those who miss early Grouper.
Grouper’s one of my very favorite musicians of all time. I’ve seen her live twice, including recently at the Hollywood Forever crematorium, which was so good it was an out-of-body experience. I listen to Grouper every night to go to sleep.
Something about her music makes me feel like I’m levitating, like I’m in a world that’s softer and less constricted by gravity and pressure, like she’s letting some air out of an overstuffed, humid room. Her music is so delicate and gossamer-like that it feels like foam on seawater, constantly breaking apart and rejoining. I can’t express how much I love it, just that I do, so much. I listen to her to sleep and I listen to her to slow down because she demands my attention to sift through the lightness and fragility of her work to find those devastatingly lovely core melodies.
Thank you for this. I’m always looking for new ambient drone artists.
*Raum, it’s early and autocorrect nailed me.
I think it’s finally time for me to get serious about Grouper
I love how detailed you were about your love for Grouper. My own love for her music comes very effortlessly, which is a rare thing for me.
I remember constantly listening to Dragging a Dead Deer...none of my friends were really into it so it felt like a very solitary experience, which heightened it all by making it so personal, private.
Thank you! This is one of those genres (on the lighter side--I top out at shoegaze or maybe late Deafheaven for my “heavy” meter), but never know where to start.
Though as a non-partaker of the doob maybe I’ll always be missing something.
As an occasional partaker of the doob, all it does for me is accentuate what I'm experiencing. If you can unmoor your mind and let it drift out, you've got 95% of it.
There's a borscht belt joke about the wife hanging low on the fruit tree, but I'll spare you all.
Freddie, are you listening to any of that OG Indian drone stuff? If not, you should. Don't worry about which artist to start with, it's not a genre with a lot of poorly crafted pieces. You can just pull up some hour long YouTube video with a buddha statue. It's a "sink in and vaguely visualize a tree growing from seed to full splendor" experience that really dampens the mind's pandemonium.
Gotta rep some OGs (there’ll be a few posts here, b/c phone). First up: the Pastels, who mostly did poppy things but dropped this monster on a 12” https://youtu.be/Eqdn8msxAbk
Not suggesting you've not heard these but some other stuff I like in this style:
Stars Of The Lid
My favourite Pauline Oliveros album is Deep Listening
Kallie Malone is an interesting newer artist.
A bit more electronic but I really recommend the Spanish artist Suso Saiz, his latest album Resonant Bodies is particularly great, tho he has a big body of work.
I lean towards more electronic music in this style so the list of ambient stuff is almost endless but those are some that I'd recommend!
The Mothmen destroyed Time in 1980 and it never fully recovered: https://youtu.be/ECELUTVCkuE
Wolfgang Press with the most appropriately drug-titled song ever: https://youtu.be/gapqi7PI4a4