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InMD's avatar

I don't think you're wrong about this. Many of these considerations were part of my family's decision to go to Catholic school instead of a perfectly fine public school. It's important to us for our kids to be immersed in an environment of in tact families who all give a f*ck. We can revisit the issue again in high school.

It's worth noting that public schools themselves, particularly the really good ones, also operate this kind of shell game. They do it based on the real estate market and restrictive zoning. This is softer and less express than what private schools do, but it's the same outcome. People pick the private school for the same reason they pick the public school that happens to be located in the solidly upper middle class or above neighborhood full of nice people who protect their turf via aggressive NIMBYism and showing up in force to any public consideration of changing boundary lines.

Here's where I will challenge Freddie, because I believe the solution to 'save' public schools from voucher-ization (and to be clear I 100% think we should) the way to do that is to change public schools, maybe a lot, and not in ways a committed leftist might like. Institute hard-core tracking based on objective capabilities. Subject the disruptive to discipline and beyond a certain point reliably segregate them from the mainstream. Maintain robust accommodations for those with documented disabilities and other special needs. You can do all of this stuff in 1 building or at one site if you want to. But I think we all also intuitively know the uncomfortable things doing something like that would reveal about who ends up where, and since we can't stomach that, a lot of places will end up with some shady and/or ramshackle voucher system.

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McJunker's avatar

I know I’m eight hours late on this and I’ll be lost in the wash. I hope Freddie reads this to hear yet another perspective from the trenches on the front.

I’m in a discipline office of a middle school in a rough area. I personally crunch the numbers on referrals and detention data.

I’m telling you this literally: .05% of the school makes life hell for the other 99.95%. They derail the classrooms, hurt and terrorize their peers, undermine the school norms that keeps shit rolling, and soak up the staff’s time and energy with no positive results and which could be better spent on students who would at least attempt to meet us halfway.

Last year, the number of fights and assaults on campus HALVED after finally getting rid of two brothers, one of whom was a stupid bully, the other of whom was a sharp and sadistic bully. A year and a half of daily referrals for threats and violence did nothing; one kid who decided he was going kill one of them with his bare hands and publicly announced his intent spooked their mom enough to withdraw them after two dozen parent meetings about their behavior failed to do anything.

Just last week, a feud between two rival groups who both were gang affiliated escalated so far that a 7th grade girl was hunted by a group of gangbangers while walking home, hit twice in the face by a grown ass man, and held at gunpoint so her enemies could beat her into a hospital room and she didn’t dare fight back. And threats to do this to each other (mostly empty threats by idiot poseurs, thankfully) are daily occurrences.

I’m fucking telling you- selectively curating the student body without hesitation or mercy is a moral and practical necessity to save public education. Simply accept that kids can volunteer themselves into the “get a GED in twenty years” roster and leave them the fuck behind. The younger the better, too. ID the third graders who threaten to murder and rape their peers while their parents refuse to answer the phone, get rid of them before their psycho shit spreads like a social contagion to their peers, and watch the positive effects blossom up through to high school.

Maintaining the boundaries of acceptable behavior is more important than the outcomes for any individual students. Expelling a student for disruption shows everyone else what flies on campus and what doesn’t; giving infinite chances to kids who keep shoving trying to find a hard barrier simply tells every other student what they can get away with, to the detriment of everyone.

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